alanjjohnstone
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Being a citizen of nowhere ie statelessness is indeed a dire condition for a personhttps://www.worldsocialism.org/spgb/socialist-standard/2010s/2015/no-1331-july-2015/material-world-stateless-capitalism
In my youth, the "Deep State" was simply the "Establishment."Our battle was with "The System", now i believe they call it "the Matrix"
Been offline for a few days so missed many of the posts but just to comment on the latest post
Quote:I clearly do agree with much of what the SPGB says that it stands for: socialism, end of money, democracy, Marxism, etc. alanjjohnstone seems to think that, perhaps some day, I'll join the party (though perhaps he's changed his mind over time).As just an exercise, LBird, why not submit your answers to the membership questions which would be the basis of accepting or rejecting any membership application and see if your critics can fault you responses.https://www.worldsocialism.org/spgb/membership-application
Casually dismissed because having claimed insight into the Party and acquainted with many of its internal debates you have not once offered any suggestions for its improvement, other than some truisms and vague generalities. Marx didn't offer the Holy Family or German Ideology to the public, he published the Communist Manifesto in the name of an actual political party.So i will rephrase the question, how would you approach the question of convincing fellow workers to strive for socialism beyond a Jehovah Witness policy of one-to-one conversion?Part of my "we" was directed at our party as you would have noticed by my explicit references to the SPGB on this thread and many others. But yes, "we" also means my fellow-workers who through fratricidal wars, famine, industrial conflict, and economic penury have been repeating the same mistakes for decade after decade, and over generations, across nations and continents. Other ideologies that can be contained by capitalism and can be wielded in the ruling class interests have prevailed. So yes, we are losing battles in the class war, we are suffering set-backs. The working class is complicit in their own exploitation and oppression because they see no alternative and think they have no choices apart from the ones they are presented with. But is it irreversible? If i thought it was, and if i did not recognise potential and possibilities in the struggles and resistance taking pace around me, i wouldn't be here. You may well be right about the presence of the many politically conscious aware workers, but where are the organisations? Workers unorganised, are impotent, as well you know. Our contribution in the SPGB is to help grow that needed organisation, and we must be sure that we are not stifling it.
We are now getting closer to an actual debate about our problems as put by me in messages # 40 and #58, LBird. As Marx pointed out
Quote:The ideas of the ruling class are in every epoch the ruling ideas, i.e. the class which is the ruling material force of society,And we have not succeeded in breaking out of their parameters, have we? We are still dominated by their cultural hegemony as Gramsci expressed itIn the war of ideas we have failed, a point i keep repeating to my party comrades. The question iis, is this a permanent defeat? Some would concede it is and advise a "humane regulated "capitalism' as more plausible. I'm an optimist and say no, although i have no tactic or strategy to offer that will mean the socialist case will prevail. I can only speculate.In message #40 i referred to those Marxists who hold hope that some inherent structural weakness within capitalism will produce desperate conditions – the need to fill an empty belly, (or if you prefer, LBird, to provide food for thought)…which will kick-start the revolution by demanding a change in consciousness, spurred by bitter class struggle that will throw up organs of workers democracy, which also means presenting fellow-workers with an ideological alternative to capitalism as a hope and an inspiration and an aspiration. Is this Sorel's revolutionary myth, not the original General Strike but now Workers Councils. We cannot present socialism as an inevitability. The Trots and the Leninists suggest the Party and the Intellectuals as the path. We argue it has to be the self-emancipation of workers themselves and although ewe may propose the method, the means will be for the workers themselves.I now ask you and i expect an answer that we can begin to implement as a organisation to unite about, what sort of socialist "party" and what type of campaign or literature do you envisage succeeding in over-turning the "ruling material force"?Can we have some answers…i'm fed up with questions when my own answers are being so casually dismissed.
Material – synonyms:physical, corporeal, tangible, nonspiritual, mundane, worldly, earthly, secular, temporal, concrete, real, solid, substantial
Quote:irrelevancies to our material livesI fear my belly over-rides my mind on so many occasions and i think that it is the motor when we discuss society and social change.
Quote:Sadly, educating a socialist working class is about the only rational activity, for the moment, that is available to a Socialist party bound by its century old Obj and Dop. Which is why Alan wants to water it down.Just to clear up something in that statement that might be misconstrued, TWC, i do NOT seek to water down the educational role of the Socialist Party. But I do believe that the world socialist movement need not be constrained by a century old expression of our object and held to a requirement for its preservation as a "historical document". (i am minded by the later caveat of Marx and Engels that they would have re-written the proposed reform measures but considered the entire Manifesto a historic document, not to be changed. How simpler it may have been if they had indeed re-edited and re-phrased the Manifesto when political conditions had changed) As someone who considers the value of the materialist conception of history, the evolution of social systems may have been hastened by the contributions of Karl Marx and the Socialist Party of Great Britain but that evolution would be a process which would have existed and continued without them. Some may well argue that socialism has been hindered by Marx and the SPGB. The only counter to such accusations is that there own failures to achieve any substantial progress casts doubt on the validity of their analysis.
LBird, your theory is like the study of cellular chemistry, perhaps necessary for a better understanding of medicine, but not required for immediate and urgent medical first-aid to resuscitate a patient.Marxism is the doctrine for the liberation of the working class and Marx defines what are its pre-requisites
Quote:“What I did that was new was to prove: (1) that the existence of classes is only bound up with the particular, historical phases in the development of production, (2) that the class struggle necessarily leads to the dictatorship of the proletariat, (3) that this dictatorship itself only constitutes the transition to the abolition of all classes and to a classless society.” (Letter from Marx to J. Weydemeyer, 1852)As been pointed out, we are not required to know or even have an opinion on everything, just the necessities for change. A reaason why i have no desire to indulge in discourses over Hegelianism and Marxism. These are luxuries of thought that we cannot afford to expend our time and energy and resources in. The SPGB's task is limited to promote the basic ideas of socialism and to engage in socialist agitation that is aimed at the people and to make that work a priority.The working class, as a class, can only end its exploitation and liberate itself from exploitation by collectivising the means of production. The working class does not own property and only lives by selling its labour for wages. It cannot liberate itself except through the socialisation of private/state property. Your concept of "theory", LBird, is not practical nor desirable and simply superfluous to the needs of our class and fellow workers. It is time to move on and concentrate upon the things that effect us and the things that we can influence and have an effect upon. What Pluto, the Sun is and whether the Moon is made of cheese are irrelevancies to our material lives, nor understanding astro-physics will assist us in building a socialist revolution and transcending capitalism. Let's get on the same game-plan.
I have no wish for the SPGB to be a philosopher's club which LBird seems intent upon making us into by his constant avoidance of constructive exchanges on actual practice, despite repeated imploring from myself. We are a political party that should be centred on political action, and that is, indeed, what is often lacking in our activity.Let's keep our eyes on the ball and not keep being distracted by esoteric debate. Marx "abandoned that to the gnawing criticism of mice". We should also abandon it to the hallowed halls of academia and obscurant intellectuals. What we have recently painfully learned is that we do not possess any meaningful connection with our fellow-workers and we are communicating a message that is not resonating with them in any significant manner.We have to address that and we aren't. We have a two-fold problem. Our case is not being effectively heard because we have no audience and when we are listened to, it is being dismissed and rejected.And we have little clue to why that is. I little care about whether folk believes Pluto or planet or not. I do care a lot that they should believe their future could be a better one if they choose to change this planet.
Wiki explains that New Mexico State" that declared that Pluto will always be considered a planet while in New Mexican skies" A bit like how every time the Queen crosses the border into Scotland, her religion changes.California and Illinois State also voted to retain Pluto as a planet. But not by referendum. Only by an elite who were not specialists or authorities in the field and who were not acting under instruction.
As i have done previously, my contribution to this thread was to direct focus it on practicalities and the class struggle for a new society, something others here seemed to think is a secondary topic.Pluto was a planet, then it was not, then it was once more. A vote decided that. And that is my only comment on the Sun.What i want to understand is not philosophy to "know" the world but to understand the means and manner of how to change it. LBird will no doubt say without there being proper sound theory we cannot make any determinations. Others may well take the opinion the principles of the SPGB remains intact although that after 113 years of existence all we could muster under our banner was less than a few hundred votes so they must review their position. This thread is sterile and futile until we begin to engage in debate and discussion of practicalities. It was Marx who after his analysis chose to build a political movement to foster a social movement – IWMA – The First International. Without a body to carry out its will the mind is meaningless (unless you believe in telepathy, telekinesis or whatever)Our challenge is to help create socialism not to discover or proclaim "truth", and we all agree that we cannot define what that is. As a wise man once wrote our demand is most modest…we only want the Earth and we need to know how to take it.
It seemed to me that those Marxists (eg Paul Mattick) who adhered to the tendency for the declining rate of profit were those Marxists who firmly believed that the workers themselves needed to emancipate themselves by their own volition – our own view – but struggled to see how workers would reach such conclusions through education when the prevailing capitalist ideology was so dominant.They had to trust in an intensifying class struggle to bring about a change in consciousness.These Marxists could only envisage capitalism growing more unstable and exploitative because of the falling rate of profit where workers have little choice but to resist through class war and they find themselves sharing a similar outlook as the Trotskyists that the class struggle is the education for socialist revolution, but rather than the Party, for the anti-Leninist Marxist it is either the syndicalist unions or worker councils which is the medium for class/socialist activity.
As expected, many other high-rises have been found to have similar fire-risks to Grenfell and hundreds of people are being evacuated and temporarily re-housed.Sad to say that, "kith and kin" once more are being given priority over "strangers". The case against offering increased admittance to refugees was based upon lack of housing yet now those homes are being found and made available. It shows what can be done when there is a political will.
http://thenational.scot/news/15366130.New_report_outlines_how_indy_Scotland_could_comfortably_raise__40bn_to_set_up_a_new_currency/If banks can create money with the stroke of a computer key-board, how does a new country creates its new currency money?
Quote:Ryan calculates Scotland could raise $40bn through a combination of transactions, including claiming a 10 per cent share of UK reserves of $163bn – ie, $16.3bn.In addition to that $16.3bn, a further $13bn, he says, could be raised via a foreign exchange swap with the Bank of England to aid the mutual stability of the economies of Scotland and of the rest of the UK.Another $8.8bn could be raised via the issue of a Euro bond and the £4.5bn-worth of hard sterling held by a new Scottish central bank could be used to buy the remaining amount.The blog certainly made use of this and its accompanying article by adapting and re-editing it a bit.http://socialismoryourmoneyback.blogspot.co.uk/2017/06/the-food-revolution.html
