alanjjohnstone
Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
It is a pity that members do not focus discussion on one website because Paddy has also made a contribution to how socialism can be organised.
“If they refused to, they would be faced with social breakdown and revolts which could endanger their personal position as members of a ruling class. Of course social breakdown is something they want to avoid but avoiding it isn’t an unreasonable aim.”
Paddy on Spintcom suggests much the same point that it might be for self-preservation from what would be the alternative.
https://groups.io/g/spintcom/message/19699
What I find very hard to accept is that the ruling class have been struck by altruism (although they make a good pretence of it such as Bill Gates philanthropy)
I am minded of the Tolstoy quote:
“I sit on a man’s back choking him and making him carry me, and yet assure myself and others that i am sorry for him and wish to lighten his load by all means possible…except by getting off his back.”
I think we need a message that goes beyond the conclusion that when push comes to shove, the ruling class acts in the interest and well-being of everybody. After this pandemic, we cannot return to normal – because the normal was what got us into this predicament in the first place, a shaky welfare state and healthcare system from decades of austerity and cut-backs.
The promise I expect to receive is that future governments will repair the damage until our collective amnesia re-imposes itself and they once again make us bear the burden of restoring the health of the economy.
I think our emphasis must be that we do not need the trillions in government bail-out money to end the consequences of the pandemic.
“Even before the pandemic struck, in most major capitalist economies, whether in the so-called developed world or in the ‘developing’ economies of the ‘Global South’, economic activity was slowing to a stop, with some economies already contracting in national output and investment, and many others on the brink…”
“I am going to bail out now I have had enough.”
A rather disappointing response from a socialist during the midst of perhaps the greatest political and economic development in certainly my life-time.
As I have tried to argue, it could also be one of socialists greatest opportunity in generations to present the case for a society of mutual solidarity.
I have moved from the position of a cynic and sceptic, highlighting in early posts the low mortality rate compared with many other illnesses and being confused by what I perceived to be an over-reaction to asking myself why the ruling class are so desperate to contain this pandemic that they are suspending some of the basic laws of capitalism itself.
I’m open to suggestions but some I have already dismissed as an insufficient explanation i.e. a plot to establish authoritarian governments. Others, i am still weighing up as the most likely such as the self-interest of the capitalist class to protect itself from a public health risk.
I recall when Upton Sinclair wrote The Jungle to expose the misery of immigrant labour in the Chicago slaughter houses, the ruling class focussed solely on the adulteration of the food and got reforms passed on the quality of the meat because they discovered just what they were eating.
Ozy, nobody is claiming that there won’t be those in power who will endeavour to take political advantage of the pandemic. See our blog
https://socialismoryourmoneyback.blogspot.com/2020/03/pandemic-populism.html
But equally we have to also acknowledge that it has empowered those who previously were seen as surplus to requirements.
Capitalism has identified who really are the key workers to the operation of its economics. Surely the shelf-stackers, the uber and gig workers will not forget the lesson. The skills and scalpel of the surgeons was very much secondary to the scrubbing brush and disinfectant of the hospital cleaners.
As in post-war Britain, people expect their sacrifices to be rewarded.
Will capitalism do this? Or will it opt instead, as it did in 2008 recession, for a course of austerity to bring back its profits and pay back the debt of extra government spending?
Surely the positive outcome is that we recognise cooperation and solidarity was what got us through COVID-19 and after it we can expect our economic demands to become higher and our newly found power exercised if we are refused.
That is what i am hoping for, anyway.
i have always had a pessimistic prognosis that capitalism was unable to solve the climate crisis because it would mean breaking the laws of capitalism…expansionism and accumulation so to make profits.
Now I have to re-evaluate that judgement.
Although capitalism cannot break its economic laws, we now see in its response to the COVID-19 pandemic that it can suspend them, certainly for a number of weeks, probably for a number of months.
So before I believed capitalism was unable implement policies to rectify the environment emergency, it now seems that it possibly can. I think though that the suspension may necessarily be for a few years…even a decade…but it has been shown that in theory that it can put aside its capitalist imperatives.
With the COVID-19 pandemic we now know how far that capitalism will go to protect the goose that lays the golden egg – the millions that are the producers and consumers.
Now the question is going to be: Is capitalism which is now procrastinating over the emergency measures that many say are necessary to avoid the climate catastrophes that are presently are in store for the world but which are not yet imminent is going to take climate actions.
We now know the capitalist class can cut output to reduce pollution and emissions and that they can re-tool their technology if they so wish, sacrificing immediate share price, dividends and profits for their longer term interests
When will the climate change timetable and future consequences result in such urgency as being shown in these crisis days, is now what environmentalists must be asking themselves.
Ministry of Defence plans to build three temporary hospitals.
Listed as phase one, London’s ExCeL centre in the capital’s docklands will have capacity of between 4,000 and 5,000 beds and will open next week.
Phase two is a temporary hospital for England and Wales at the National Exhibition Centre in Birmingham, with a capacity for 5,000 beds, and will open in mid-April.
The third phase is a 1,000-bed facility at the Manchester Central Conference Centre (formerly the GMEX Centre) and will also open in mid-April.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NHS_Nightingale_Hospital
It seems that the pending posts have all appeared at once and has made the thread out of synch.
But I return to my question on Spintcom
https://groups.io/g/spintcom/message/19692
What is the motive that the capitalist class – collectively, not just one vested interest section nor one national group – seek to cut off their nose to spite their face?
Why adopt globally much the same policies – all which harm the economy?
If the threat is not real that makes no sense to me.
Iran’s supreme leader has today refused US humanitarian assistance to fight the new coronavirus, citing an unfounded conspiracy theory that the virus could be man-made by America. Washington has offered to help Iran while refusing to lift crushing sanctions blocking the country from selling its crude oil and accessing international financial markets.
Ayatollah Ali Khamenei said:
“Possibly your (offered) medicine is a way to spread the virus more, Khamenei said. Or if you send therapists and doctors, maybe he wants to see the effect of the poison, since it is said that part of the virus is built for Iran.”
Not just Cubans but Russians are being sent to Italy
Also to note is that Italy’s high mortality is related to the general age of its population. It has the second oldest population worldwide. The median is 67, compared to China which was 46. 87 per cent of deaths in the country have been in patients over 70 years old while 88 per cent of patients who have died had at least one pre-morbidity – many had two or three.
“It would appear that most governments round the world are genuinely trying to save lives now and acting on the best possible medical and scientific advice.”
There is a notable exception, climate change denialist Bolsonaro of Brasil
While Sweden is under criticism also
Yes we are selfish self-interested people who’d never risk our lives to help another [sarcasm]
The number of people who have volunteered to help the NHS in its fight against coronavirus has passed half a million, double the government’s recruitment target. The helpers are needed for delivering food and medicines, driving patients to appointments and phoning the isolated.
https://www.goodsamapp.org/nhs
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-52029877
Outside this government initiative various mutual aid groups have sprung up
Pandemic Insolvency: Why This Economic Crisis Will Be Different
“Covid-19 has given global capitalism a labour scarcity shock, which is hitting demand and supply simultaneously. Workers cannot work during quarantines and lockdowns, and so firms cannot produce and workers cannot consume. Capitalists and workers are becoming insolvent simultaneously”
“The prestige of Chinese-style state capitalism is growing. Keynesian and Modern Monetary Theory economists will find jobs in high places, and market socialism-with-nationalisations will continue to strengthen its position as the dominant economic doctrine on the left.”
