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The only socialist group that ever existed in Latin America was located in Jamaica, and the WSM website has all their writings, it was unique, and a 360 % move away from Castroism, Guevaraism, Maoism and Sovietism. Nobody has ever had the same conception including the larger communist party in Latin America and theoriticians
There was a member of the WSM living in the Dominican Republic, he is a lawyer and he was involved in the Leninist movement since he was in secondary schools and he was a member of the International Communist Current, and the MPD
He was abandoned and nobody from the WSM communicated with him and he came back to leftism again, the WSM lost the opportunity of having a new companion party in the Caribbean region again because he knows many peoples from different organizations
He knows Marxism, Leninism, Stalinism and Maoism
What i’m saying is there must be socialists, or at least people coming close to socialism there, and globally, who have never heard of the WSM, but who, like us, reject leftism.
It is arrogant indeed to think that we alone have come to our, or at least similar, conclusions, when discontent is ever more widespread.They might not even use the word socialism, because they equate the word with leftist, authoritarian, groups.
The Socialist Party has written that without Marx and Engels they could have created their own conception of socialism because their ideas did not depart from the soviet experiences, on the contrary, since the very beginning they were very critical about Bolshevism
The WSPUS was founded by British and Canadians.
Most groups, political parties and individuals from Latin American depart from the Soviet experience, some rejected castroism in order to adopt Maoism, some rejected Maoism to adopt Hoxhaism, even more, CLR James rejected the vanguard party concept and he kept Leninism and Trotskyism, and he is not well known because he is a black man from the minor Antilles, but Maurice Bishop is widely known because he was a Castroist
Someone at the Socialist Party wrote : The world did not know socialism or Marxism, the world knew Leninism and Stalinism, the past is living on top of the present,
The Marxist Humanists have rejected the vanguard party to lead, but they kept Lenin, and the Soviet Union became capitalist during 1930 when Stalin solidified his power and Lenin became ambivalent in 1914, when he was reading Hegel, but they have rejected Engels, and despite all Engels mistakes he was more correct than Lenin,
Raya wrote that capitalism collapsed in 1930 and it was save by world state capitalism, and the collapsing theory has been proven to be mistaken, capitalism did not collapse
They have contradictions with Trotskyism but they transformed the permanent revolution into revolution in permanence, and the permanent revolution is one of the pilar of Bolshevism along with La Salle vanguard party concept. They all depart from the soviet experience
The ICC have rejected several ideas of Lenin but they still insist that the bolshevik coup was a socialist revolution and all the problem started with Joseph Stalin, and the ICC has many branches in Latin America but they are not so popular as the Castroists and Maoist groups. the CCI has debunked Castroism, Maoism and Guevaraism completely
The SLP of America had a branch in Puerto Rico and I think they supported its independence from the USA, and they should have known better that classical colonialism was replaced by capitalism, it is like supporting the Palestinian state, another capitalist state based on a capitalist mode of production.
They have good theoreticians and intellectuals and activist but all of them depart from the soviet experience
PJShannon
Keymaster
The user MS asked to be removed from the forum, for reasons apparently unrelated to the discussion, and I’ve complied with the request.
————————————————————————–MS left because his google email was compromised, someone from somewhere inserted a hacking link on Paula message, the argument was that the email address was posting too many messages that the ISP had to be verified, using a catching code provided by them . whoever sent it was playing with an old fox. Private email with end to end encryption are more secured. A paid investigation has been initiated
What i’m saying is there must be socialists, or at least people coming close to socialism there, and globally, who have never heard of the WSM, but who, like us, reject leftism.
It is arrogant indeed to think that we alone have come to our, or at least similar, conclusions, when discontent is ever more widespread.They might not even use the word socialism, because they equate the word with leftist, authoritarian, groups.
============================================================================Probably the CCI and they are Leninists, and they have branches in different countries in Latin America and some of them are run by one or two individuals.
The WSM does not use the word Internationalist because it means within nations, and probably the CCI has more branches and members than the WSM and they have had several splits and they have alliances with several tendencies
The CCI is more open to discussion than all other leftist groups, and they are willing to travel from Spain to another country to form a group or a branch.
There is a newspaper which has more coverage than the CCI and publish news everyday and they are Trotskyists part of the fourth international
https://www.laizquierdadiario.com. Chile, Mexico, Argentina, Venezuela, Bolivia, Paraguay, etc etcThomas Mor
The MLPUSA started to question Mao, Stalin and Hoxha and the organization was disolved, but they did not question Leninism, and another small group was formed but they kept Leninism
If the left question Leninism it would be like removing the four legs of a table and it will fall in the floor, most of them call themselves leftists, and some have created the concept of left of capital, or seudo left which means that there is a section of the left that is socialist.
I have published articles published by the WSM/SPGB on several leftist groups and the articles correctly cite Karl Marx and Engels and they have responded saying that they are anti marxist analysis, or yellow journalism, therefore, it would be better to argue with an evangelical, and some of them tabulate a comparison between Marx and Lenin like
Marxism versus Leninism
Thomas:
Conclusion: The Socialist Party is different to all other organizations, and it is a genuine socialist/communist party because it did not depart from the soviet/Leninist/Bolsheviks and social democrats experiences, it departed from the experiences of Marx and Engels, and they developed socialism and Marxism to a higher level, instead of distorting their body of ideas, even more, without Marx and Engels, the socialist party would have created their own socialist conception, but we must also recognize that Marx and Engels did a lot of works for the working class, and we do not worship them we have also recognized the mistakes that they made
Careful when using the word ‘depart’ from. You mean ‘comes from.’
To English readers it sounds like we ‘never left’ Lenin Stalin and Mao! But I know you mean we have never been with them.Careful when using the word ‘depart’ from. You mean ‘comes from.’
To English readers it sounds like we ‘never left’ Lenin Stalin and Mao! But I know you mean we have never been with them.
———————————————————————–Remember that revisionism, the vanguard party to lead, reformism, bolsheviks, Mensheviks came from the Social Democracy and the Second international before Leninism and Stalinism. Marx wrote about the Social Democrats party on the Gotha Program and Rosa Luxembourg wrote about Reformism and Bernstein revisionism, and the Bolsheviks took several conceptions from the social democracy and the second international, although most Leninists have said that he learned from Georgi Plekhanov but Plekhanov opposed the bolsheviks coup, but they do not say that Kautsky and Lasalle were the propagator of the vanguard party and the original idea came from the Jacobin
We have another Spanish speaking member in Spain and I have communicated with him several times by email and personal phone calls, he is an old good man, but he has difficulties to use computers. Lately, I have called him several times but he does answer the phone. He has a nice Spanish accent ( or Castilian ) and he is very affable, and he is very friendly
————————————————————————–PS: With the new encrypted end to end private email account from Tutanota ( located in Germany, and Proton in Switzerland ) I will use two surnames in the same subscription to this forum: Almamater ( honoring my lovely UPR ) and Ciudadano del Mundo ( honoring Eugene Debs ) but it is only one account, and one subscription, therefore, I do not want anybody to send an email trying to verify my ISP because it is going to be hidden. Google, Yahoo, AOL are not safe and they are free, they have been hacked several times, emails, personal informations, and passwords were sent to the dark web, there is a class action lawsuit against them. I do not care about of whatever you want to call me
I only call forum members by the names they go by on the forum.
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That is what I meant, I do respect your personal decision, If somebody wants to use a surname in order to protect his/her job and the family that is his/her personal decision. I do not care about the name given by your parents.
When we had yahoo groups members used to have several email accounts, that was their problem, it was not our problem. it was not a forum for personal biography
I have two forums using Groups IO ( it is much better than word press ) and I do not care how many emails accounts they use, and I do not care how many surname they use, the same case is with Facebook and Twitter
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