Syria: will the West attack?

May 2024 Forums General discussion Syria: will the West attack?

  • This topic has 366 replies, 20 voices, and was last updated 6 years ago by ALB.
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  • #95963
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    He has  been called a mad leader by the right wingers, but he  is already having large support from the left wingers, and most of them believe that there is an intimate relationship between the leader of a capitalist state and the peoples, and then, they call themselves Marxists or socialists and they do not even know what the character of the state is. It is not strange either that some left wings groups will be supporting and calling  the British parliament as a hero or a friend of the English workers, but in some way the British capitalists would prefer that the Syrian groups kill among themselves, and having a weaker situation they will be able to take control of the resources along with the US capitalists, similar to the situation in Iraq where the army was practically disarmed and defeated before the war, and there were internal conflicts among each others

    #95964
    Anonymous
    Inactive
    #95965
    ALB
    Keymaster

    Now Obama is getting cold feet too. What was that ditty about the Grand Old Duke of York? If only …

    #95966
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Oh, The grand old Duke of York,He had ten thousand men;He marched them up to the top of the hill,And he marched them down again.And when they were up, they were up,And when they were down, they were down,And when they were only half-way up,They were neither up nor down.

    #95967
    alanjjohnstone
    Keymaster

    I found the article link not very impressive, Gnome.I do not accept his claim that Assad has offered to step down repeatedly. I would appreciate some evidence of this. The fact that Obama hasn't assassinated Assad as proof he wants Assad in place is very tenuous. Nor am I impressed with the dollar v euro conspiracy. It puts the cart before the cart horse. The $ is strong because the US is strong so it is the World's favourite currency. The US isn't strong because of the strength of the $.  His belief that Syrian air defence is an effective one isn't too accurate either when Israel has already demonstrated the ease it has in attacking Syrian targets. The articles assumption that the Jihadists are not aware they are doing America's dirty work is laughable. They are willing pawns as they were in Libya because they know they get the perks of money and guns. When they do turn on their pay-masters it won't be because of a sudden realisation they were killing Shi'ites rather than Americans.But the article is right that the West want a impotent divided emasculated Syria to manipulate and the best way is to keep it bogged down in a long drawn out seemingly endless civil war. Turn it into another Lebanon. This suits Israel, when Hezbullah turn their rockets on Syrian rebels. Supporting Syrian government is costing Iran a fair amount, weakening it even further economically. 

    #95968
    alanjjohnstone
    Keymaster

    This quite a good overview article on Syria and adds to a previous post by myself on Qatar's gas pipe-line through Syria motives for their intervention http://www.alternet.org/world/syria-intervention-plan-fueled-oil-interests-not-chemical-weapon-concern?paging=off

    #95969
    alanjjohnstone
    Keymaster

    The Mossad intelligencehttp://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2013/08/the-troodos-conundrum/ An interesting RT cliphttp://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=FViX1sBtdaw

    #95970
    ALB
    Keymaster

    Some of the leaflets handed out at yesterday's "No Attack on Syria" demo show the confusion of the Left on the issue.The Communist Party of Great Britain (Marxist-Leninist) takes up a pro-Syrian government position:

    Quote:
    From the very beginning of the counter-revolutionary rebellion in Syria, inspired, funded and aided by imperialism, we in the CPGB-ML have consistently called for the defeat of imperialism and the victory of the Syrian people led by President Assad (…) Victory to the Syrian people led by the Ba'ath Party and its progressive allies !

    Two Trotskyist groups, Socialist Resistance and International Socialist Newtwork (an SWP breakaway) take the opposite position of supporting the rebels:

    Quote:
    We believe that the people of Syria should be enabled to free themselves from the Assad dictatorship. For their struggle to be successful, they should receive all the necessary material aid, including arms and humanitarian assistance, without conditions imposed by the West (…) Solidarity with the revolution against the Assad dictatorship.

    Their leaflet advertises a meeting to be addressed by Gilbert Achcar, one of the leaders of one of the Fourth Internationals, but also one of the signatures of the recent appeal in the Guardian to form the proposed new Left Party. It looks as if the new party is going to have some interesting discussions about where to procure arms to send to the Syrian rebels.In their leaflet SPEW declares that, following the government's defeat in the House of Commons

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    Cameron and Clegg could over the coming days and weeks be forced out. The government itself could be brought down. The trade union movement … could finish off this floundering cuts coalition by calling a national day of strike action — a 24-hour general strike – against cuts and austerity.

    On Syria they say that they are

    Quote:
    completely opposed to the murderous Assad regime. Nor do we give any support to the reactionary, sectarian forces who dominate the anti-Assad opposition, We stand for the building of a united, non-sectarian mass movement of workers and the poor to establish independent trade unions and a mass workers' party that can play a key role in overthrowing Assad.

    That's it. The Syrian trade unions should call a 24-hour general strike to overthrow the Assad government.Finally, there was a leaflet from the third force involved in armed conflict in Syria, the Kurdish nationalists, who have started what they call "the Rojava revolution" ("rojava" being, according to the internet, their name for western Kurdistan, currently part of Syria).  In their leaflet the "Refugee Workers' Cultural Association" complain about the Turkish government for supporting "many gang groups such as Al Nusra, connected with Al Kaeda" who have been attacking the Kurdish population in North East Syria (and driven thousands across the border into Iraqi Kurdistan). They are opposed to "imperialist intervention" in Syria because it

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    would also mean an intervention to the Kurdish people's effort to create a common democratic management together with other national and ethnic people, and to the Rojava Revolution. The Rojava revolution has already shown the people of the Middle East of which path to follow. This path is democratic and revolutionary path (…) Let's be shoulder to shoulder against all efforts to choke Rojava revolution.
    #95971
    SocialistPunk
    Participant
    alanjjohnstone wrote:
    But the article is right that the West want a impotent divided emasculated Syria to manipulate and the best way is to keep it bogged down in a long drawn out seemingly endless civil war. Turn it into another Lebanon. This suits Israel, when Hezbullah turn their rockets on Syrian rebels. Supporting Syrian government is costing Iran a fair amount, weakening it even further economically

    Keep a country tied up in chaos and it becomes impotent, unable to function on the world stage. Less competition for the manipulators while selling weaponry to anyone for huge profits. Perhaps a little simplified, but does anyone see things differently?A few weeks back I saw a Newsnight report about Yemen and the conditions the people have to endure because of Americas fight against al Qaeda. Drone aircraft are killing pretty much indiscriminately, in their search for terrorists. The people were fed up, seeing their family and friends murdered. The irony was that al Qaeda, turned up after the attacks to offer financial support and help people rebuild homes, thus gaining potential support. The west are creating a breeding ground for potential terrorist recruits. The locals interviewed all said they disagreed with al Qaeda, they just wanted to get on with their lives, as most people do. Though I expect some would question their sincerity.Like most on this site I question the motives behind a strategy that causes such obvious misery and chaos. If the west really want to tackle terrorism, surely the best way to do so is by cutting off support and recruitment. The most effective method I can see would be helping people to better their conditions and gain their trust. Like wise if you want to create hatred and potential terrorists, the best way is to wreck lives and create fear and instability. It's not rocket science.Perhaps it has more to do with rockets sales.Chaos and capitalism go hand in hand. If anyone has seen the dubious film, The Great Rock n Roll Swindle, Malcolm McLaren used the slogan "cash from chaos" frequently. He was more accurate than perhaps he realised. Am I oversimplifying things? I have been somewhat pre-occupied lately and have pretty much missed most world events, I even "slept" through most of the recent Syrian, chemical warfare outrage. It was hilarious to see the PM performing a Blairesque moral crusade act. I wonder if these people actually believe their own bullshit, or just know they will most likely get away with it ?

    #95972
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    <It was hilarious to see the PM performing a Blairesque moral crusade act. I wonder if these people actually believe their own bullshit, or just know they will most likely get away with it ? This was Galloway after the vote rubbing Camerons nose in it.http://www.codewit.com/europe/11776-george-galloway-heated-speech-british-parliament-debate-on-military-action-against-syria-8/29/2013-vdeo

    #95973
    SocialistPunk
    Participant
    US President, Obama wrote:
    "We cannot accept a world where women and children and innocent civilians are gassed on a terrible scale."

    Presumably he can accept a world were women and children are blown to pieces by American missiles, time and time again. Over time collateral damage mounts up "on a terrible scale".

    #95974
    SocialistPunk
    Participant

    Has anyone got a take on the Labour stance against attacking the Syrian regime?Was it Labour playing at party politics or have Labour fingers been burnt by the deceit used during the build up to the Iraq invasion in 2003?

    #95975
    J Surman
    Participant

    Here's a link to a very interesting article by Mahdi Darius Nazemroaya from Global Reasearch from last week  connecting the dots to the 1982 Yinon plan.http://tinyurl.com/kedjnuh&nbsp; or  http://www.globalresearch.ca/yinons-revenge-a-panoramic-of-chaos-in-the-arab-world/5346899Oded Yinon is quoted throughout  to back up the point the author is making. Broken up states, smaller and more chaotic entities are easier to control and when you take a look at the original list of the 'axis of evil' countries I think he speaks a lot of sense. We shouldn't view Syria separately, in my opinion, it's a part of the wider plan for the area in which Iran features too, originally drawn up by Yinon and soon endorsed by the US government and military.You can google the Yinon plan if you want more on that.

    #95976
    SocialistPunk
    Participant

    Very interesting article JS. I've been doing a fair bit of research recently on this subject. The elites in the oil rich middle eastern countries coupled with oil greedy foreign powers are playing a very dangerous game, the old classic of divide and conquer.The concern that workers in the rest of the world should have, if they are not concerned with the misery of others, is that the utter chaos stirred up will at some point spill over and burn them. The manipulators don't suffer but  the working class end up the targets of angry fanatics, venting their frustration on easy targets. So much for "the war on terror". It is the exact opposite.

    #95977
    alanjjohnstone
    Keymaster

    Hezbollah  mobilises. Hezbollah fighters have left their regular posts in several villages in the southern Lebanese city of Tyre and the Bekaa Valley over the past five days, AFP reported. Teenagers have replaced more experienced Hezbollah fighters at checkpoints in Beirut.   Lebanon's al-Akhbar daily reports Hezbollah “has called on all its officers and members to man their positions." http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2013/09/02/321736/hezbollah-mobilizes-forces-over-syria/

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