imposs1904
Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
We all get that it's an attempt at a Private Eye'ish style front cover, but I'm not a fan. Vin's right: The Corbyn speech bubble feeds into the narrative being pushed down people's throats in the media right now. It's lazy and it's alienating. Some Party members just don't get it.And what's with the Cameron speech bubble and the 1870s gibe? Disraeli's One Nation Toryism was in power for the second half of the 1870s and it was a bastard sight more progressive than the class warriors currently in power. You don't have to be a historian of the 19th century to know that: A quick glance at his wiki page could have told you that.From the wiki page:Reforming legislation[Under the stewardship of Richard Assheton Cross, the Home Secretary, Disraeli's new government enacted many reforms, including the Artisan's and Labourers' Dwellings Improvement Act 1875,[176] which made inexpensive loans available to towns and cities to construct working-class housing. Also enacted were the Public Health Act 1875, modernising sanitary codes through the nation,[177] the Sale of Food and Drugs Act (1875), and the Education Act (1876).[176] Disraeli's government also introduced a new Factory Act meant to protect workers, the Conspiracy and Protection of Property Act 1875, which allowed peaceful picketing, and the Employers and Workmen Act (1875) to enable workers to sue employers in the civil courts if they broke legal contracts. As a result of these social reforms the Liberal-Labour MP Alexander Macdonald told his constituents in 1879, "The Conservative party have done more for the working classes in five years than the Liberals have in fifty."
A Gilmac article from 1954. One for the SPGB anoraks, 'Some notes on party history':http://socialiststandardmyspace.blogspot.com/2015/08/some-notes-on-party-history-1954.html
From a Barltrop article from 1977, a telling quote from Sidney Webb in 1930 which reveals that the Labour elite has pretty much always despised its own membership and supporters:"that the constituency parties were frequently unrepresentative groups of nonentities dominated by fanatics and cranks, and extremists, and that if the block votes of the trade unions were eliminated it would be impracticable to continue to vest the control of policy in Labour Party Conferences."From this article:http://socialiststandardmyspace.blogspot.com/2015/08/the-left-once-more-boring-from-within.html
jondwhite wrote:imposs1904 wrote:Vin's makes a fair point. I'm not suggesting for a second that we soft-pedal our criticisms of Labour in all its forms, but these memes just seem to be the one tone and I think they're going to backfire on us. Why would Corbyn supporters investigate our politics further if that's the first thing they see coming from us?I think these are only appealing to a small pool of individuals; individuals, in the main, who are already aware of Labour's sorry history in government.what if there was a meme image creates about exposing the anti working class nature of prime minister Cameron or Nigel farage?
I actually think that's different. Despite the apparent 'Jezzmania' – or whatever it's called this week – I don't think Corbyn is as ego driven as your usual professional politician. Maybe that absence of 'look at me, everyone' is part of his attraction for a lot of people at this point. I think he genuinely believes in a more inclusive and democratic Labour Party and movement, and I wouldn't say that for most Labour left-wingers. Sadly, we know it's not going to work out for him.I think it's fair game to have digs at the likes of Farage, Cameron . . . and the Galloways, Livingstones and Abbots of this world because it's so self-evident that it's their self-regard as much as their ideology which motors them, but having snide digs at Corbyn at this point just makes us come off as the sectarians that everyone thinks we already are.In my opinion, it's wrong-headed.
ALB wrote:jondwhite wrote:what if there was a meme image creates about exposing the anti working class nature of prime minister Cameron or Nigel farage?The front cover of the September Socialist Standard should fit the bill if you can wait a week.
I really wish we'd stop putting politicians faces on the front cover of the Standard. Maybe I'm showing my age but I sometimes wish we'd harken back to the really old Standards where there would be an article on the front cover of the Standard.
"moronic moderation" is a silly and unhelpful term, but I would say that the recent banning of Stuart from the forum was absolutely ridiculous and over the top. If a chair had acted like that in a meeting, there would have been a motion to remove them from the chair.Discretion should have been applied during that particular thread, and to suggest that the moderator had to abide by the rules just wont wash.
Vin's makes a fair point. I'm not suggesting for a second that we soft-pedal our criticisms of Labour in all its forms, but these memes just seem to be the one tone and I think they're going to backfire on us. Why would Corbyn supporters investigate our politics further if that's the first thing they see coming from us?I think these are only appealing to a small pool of individuals; individuals, in the main, who are already aware of Labour's sorry history in government.
I agree with Vin.I think the moderator should have also taken into account that it was a brief light-hearted exchange, and that it really wasn't some sort of malicious or mischievous attempt to derail a thread.
jondwhite wrote:In a couple of Marx's works, he refers to 'vulgar democrats'. What was he getting at?Could you link to the articles or passages where he makes the reference. The context could explain what he's getting at.
I agree with Vin, and apologies for my part in the thread which resulted in Stuart being temporarily suspended from posting to the forum.I understand the general rule of keeping on topic – and I don't envy the role that the moderator has to perform – but I think discretition should be employed sometimes. It was a temporary – and lighthearted – detour from the topic at hand.
stuartw2112 wrote:Excellent point Darren, but you're forgetting that your taste in music is wrong and punk was just awful.
post-punk, cheeky chops.I made a point of mentioning it twice in my post just in case someone got the wrong end of the drumstick. Now, please leave the thread with your Rush albums tucked under your arm. You have no place on a thread that touches on great music.
"(Only slightly a joke – the music of the period was made possible by full employment and the welfare state.)"Don't forget the Art Schools.My favourite period of music is – surprise, surprise – 1978 thru' 1983, and many a NME type has made the point that that period blossomed musically only because of high youth unemployment and a crumbling infrastructure which meant that the youth of the day had nothing better to do than create brilliant post-punk music and practice their (post) punky sneer in the bedroom mirror.It works both ways.
I could see Left Unity dissolving if Corbyn wins. They have been some of his biggest cheerleaders on social media.
