March 2023 › Forums › General discussion › Syria again
- This topic has 79 replies, 11 voices, and was last updated 1 month, 3 weeks ago by alanjjohnstone.
December 21, 2018 at 12:34 pm #173910
Before this forum got closed down by a hacking attack we had a thread on the civil war in Syria. In view of Trump’s decision to withdraw US ground troops from there, maybe we should revive this.
Here’s something from RT, the Russian state propaganda station, with an interesting list of “liberal” warmongers in the US:
https://www.rt.com/op-ed/447067-hollywood-syria-liberals-withdrawal/December 21, 2018 at 3:03 pm #173912
Trump is also cutting half the troops in Afghanistan.
These decisions have resulted in the resignation of defense sectretary Mattis, some say.
The Europeans and the Kurds are not too happy with the withdrawal, announced shortly after Turkey declared a new offensive
But which now has been postponed
(i’m guessing it is to give time to the Americans to move out from being embedded with the Kurds…but it only a guess)December 22, 2018 at 2:28 am #173965
More on the background of the withdrawal and why Mattis resigned.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/dec/21/james-mattis-resignation-trump-erdogan-phone-callDecember 22, 2018 at 2:51 am #173966AnonymousInactive
http://www.voltairenet.org/article204433.html. This might be a good explanation of why they are leaving in a hurry. It was going to be another Vietnam defeat. They entered into an agreement with Turkey which is going to buy 3.5 billion dollars in weapons from the USA. For the second time, the Kurds have been betrayed by the USA government. It is also an election campaign for Donald TrumpDecember 22, 2018 at 7:59 am #173974Dave BParticipant
“…………Yet the Trump administration’s continued support for the YPG is not as entirely baseless as portrayed. The militants’ objectives in the region complement many of those stated by Tillerson and the group has largely shown itself as a willing proxy for the US to aid. But whilst such support may make sense in principle, in practice, the effects could be more detrimental to America than predicted………….”
“……….The brigade is composed mostly by communists, socialists and anarchists from Europe……….”
politically associated with the PKK?
“…..the movement included and cooperated with other ethnic groups, including ethnic Turks, who were following the radical left. The organization initially presented itself as part of the worldwide communist revolution.
So it is/was a bit like the US supporting the Vietcong and Sandinista’s this time?December 22, 2018 at 9:31 am #173980
The PKK had its origins in Maoism and, despite its change of aim, is still organised on top-down, Leninist lines. Ironically, it is this Leninist structure which has made its armed wing in Syria, the YPG, an effective fighting force. So no wonder the US decided to rely on them rather than the ragbag of unruly jihadists and simple gangsters that make up the other armed rebel groups.December 22, 2018 at 10:44 am #173999Dave BParticipant
“We cannot declare war on everyone at once but we need to be smart in how we play our enemies while still sticking to our values,”
Anarchy in the YPG:
https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/revolution-volunteers-form-anarchist-brigade-ypg-1459563614December 22, 2018 at 7:35 pm #174030AnonymousInactive
The PKK had its origins in Maoism and, despite its change of aim, is still organised on top-down, Leninist lines
That is the reason why so many leftwingers individuals and leftwing organizations support them, as always, they are supporting the wrong groups of peoples, and they always end up supporting one sector of a ruling class. They will never learn their history lesson, that is one of the reasons why I never waste my time with Leninists, I know them like the palm of my handsDecember 22, 2018 at 7:38 pm #174031AnonymousInactive
The USA government would prefer to support Maoists rather than supporting Islamic radicals. They have learned from China, Vietnam and CambodiaDecember 22, 2018 at 7:50 pm #174032AnonymousInactive
So it is/was a bit like the US supporting the Vietcong and Sandinista’s this time?
The Vietcong has given to the western capitalists the workers of Vietnam in a silver platter. Our stand regarding the Vietnam war and the Vietcong has proven that we were totally correct. All those groups that were supporting the Vietcong and Mao Tse Tung now are hidden under a bed because they do not want to confront the realityDecember 22, 2018 at 7:57 pm #174033AnonymousInactive
Even more, Enver Hoxha who was a Stalinist said that Maoism was a new form of Chinese Confucianism, and he was right, whoever has read the works of Mao and Buddhism would find a similarityDecember 22, 2018 at 8:26 pm #174034AnonymousInactive
The Leninists such as the Trotskyists, Stalinists and Maoists called themselves Marxist, but instead of using the Materialist conception of history, they will apply on their analysis the Individualistic conception of history, it is always a leader, or prestigious figures the one who makes history. In this conflicts, they are elevating to the priesthood the figure of Putin and Erdogan, and sometimes they support any radical from the Islamic world like the Iranians. They are anti-Yankees, but they are not anti-capitalistDecember 23, 2018 at 4:55 am #174048
“The recent decision by the president came as a shock and was a complete reversal of policy that was articulated to us,” McGurk wrote, according to the paper. “It left our coalition partners confused and our fighting partners bewildered….I ultimately concluded that I could not carry out these new instructions and maintain my integrity.”December 23, 2018 at 6:25 am #174052AnonymousInactive
It does show that most US politicians and ministers support wars and interventions. The border wall and the removal of the troops from Siria is just an election move made by Donald Trump to please his supporters. ISIS and the Taliban have not been defeated and they armed and used themDecember 27, 2018 at 8:20 pm #174622
On this visit to troops in Iraq Trump declared that the US no longer wanted to be “the global policeman”:
President Donald Trump used a lightning visit to Iraq — his first with US troops in a conflict zone since being elected — to defend the withdrawal from Syria and declare an end to America’s role as the global “policeman.” (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/afp/article-6531053/US-President-Donald-Trump-makes-surprise-Iraq-visit.html )
If true, this is surely a significant development. It would be a reversal of US policy since it belatedly joined in WW2 in 1942 and would meet the long-standing demand of groups like Stop the War (Corbyn must be happy too as that’s why he’s always been anti-American). But I don’t think that the Left is going to give him credit for this but will continue on autopilot denouncing “Trumpism” as more the enemy than capitalism. Of course we don’t know if the US really will return to isolationism.
The other thing that this confirms that it is the elected president and his administration not the unelected military that runs the US state. A repeat on a mini-scale of President Truman’s sacking of General MacArthur in 1951.
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