New anarchist organisation, The Anarchist Communist Group

February 2024 Forums Events and announcements New anarchist organisation, The Anarchist Communist Group

Viewing 14 posts - 16 through 29 (of 29 total)
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  • #132071
    KAZ
    Participant
    ALB wrote:
    It is not true, eiher, that anarchism is a subset of socialism. Some anarchists do stand for socialism (as a classless, stateless, moneyless, wageless society) but only a minority.

    Well, aye, but that would equally apply to the majority of bods calling themselves socialist! Self-labelled anarchists have always been pretty diverse, both in principles and tactics, but if we take the 'big men' (the equivalent of Marx) – Kropotkin and Bakunin – would fit the bill. The same could be said of the organised anarchist groups in this country, both historically and contemporary. Personally, I think it is no coincidence that the SPGB stall at the London Anarchist Book Fair was busy, busy, busy (SS sold out I believe). 'Propaganda of the deed' and 'illegalism' – obviously there were dicks back in the day too.

    #132072
    ALB
    Keymaster
    KAZ wrote:
    'Propaganda of the deed' and 'illegalism' – obviously there were dicks back in the day too.

    They are still about:http://www.ekathimerini.com/226293/article/ekathimerini/news/anarchists-threaten-escalation-in-violence

    #132073
    KAZ
    Participant

    Threw stones at the riot police, did a sit in at the local paper and set fire to a dumpster. Dawn is near.

    #132074
    KAZ
    Participant

    Still, the anarchists of Exarchia did throw Yanis Varoufakis out of his favourite restaurant. They can't be *all* bad.

    #132075
    ALB
    Keymaster
    KAZ wrote:
    Threw stones at the riot police, did a sit in at the local paper and set fire to a dumpster.

    Yes, there is a bit of a disjoint between their rhetoric and their actions, a common feature of r-r-revolutionarygroups. Bakunin was the same, a comic opera insurrectionist when it came to actully doing something.

    #132076
    KAZ
    Participant

    "r-r-revolutionary": Any idea where that SPGB meme comes from? Never heard it anywhere else. I think of Terry the Tiger (or whatever his name was, I don't pay a lot of attention to adwerts) – "they're g-r-r-eat!" but I think it might be older than that.

    #132077
    KAZ
    Participant

    Enough of my ramblings though. A bit of mess about and manhandling a minister hardly amounts to illegalism or propaganda of the deed. More like your regular protest. At least it's directed at the right people – unlike illegalism. Other times they've gone way overboard but Greeks have a tendency to do that (little bit of racism there). The point about Exarchia is that it is a "liberated area". Something like a big squat. I'm not saying it's going anywhere (Freetown Christiania probably shows it's ultimate fate – not snuffed out but 'redeveloped' – yuppified – with the connivance of its residents) but these sort of alternative communities are quite harmless and possibly beneficial.

    #132078
    ALB
    Keymaster
    KAZ wrote:
    "r-r-revolutionary": Any idea where that SPGB meme comes from? Never heard it anywhere else.

    It don't think it is a "SPGB meme". A meme perhaps but not one we started. A quick search on the internet has turned up two, but there will be more: one by Zizek and this one:

    Quote:
    I say nothing of those “revolutionaries” — save the mark! — who begin the work of organising artels by removing the bells from the churches. Just imaging removing the church bells — how r-r-revolutionary!

    By Stalin in 1930. See here. He wasn't talking about anarchists, though it's the sort of r-r-revolutionary thing they might do — in fact did do in Spain and more, like shooting the priest too.Since you are now moving in anarchist circles I imagine you will be coming across quite a few r-r-revolutionary windbags

    #132079
    jondwhite
    Participant

    A search of Marxists Internet Archive shows the term 'r-r-revolutionary' goes back to 1909 used by both Kautsky and Lenin. Not sure who was firsthttps://www.google.co.uk/search?&q=r-r-revolutionary+site%3Amarxists.org

    #132080
    DJP
    Participant

    Anarchism has only really been a thing in latin speaking countries. This is what the Spanish anarcho-syndicalist CGT is organising on March 8th.http://cgt.org.es/noticias-cgt/noticias-cgt/argumentario-de-cgt-para-la-huelga-general-del-8-de-marzohttp://cgt.org.es/rntv-29-huelga-8-de-marzoOK It's not going to bring about socialism but I sound piece of trade unionism. Not all "anarchists" are going around picking on poor defenceless rubbish bins. But of course not to paint too a rosey picture, in Spain "anarchist" responce to the catalonian situation was pretty dreadful.http://libcom.org/library/catalonian-affair-miguel-amor-s

    #132081
    Rusty Pigfumbler
    Participant
    KAZ wrote:
    . If the Founders really did endorse this sentiment, incidentally, why would they be selling literature by Kropotkin – the 'Anarchist Prince'?

    Not the first time this allegation has been made. Those who say it must have evidence but have yet to reveal it. Eleanor Marx's translation of George Plekhanov's assault on anarchist philosophy and practice 'Anarchism and Socialism'  was valued by the original members, but Kropotkin..?

    #132082
    ALB
    Keymaster

    Good point. I don't think "the founders" were that enamoured of Kropotkin though they don't seem to have regarded him as as bad as some other anarchists. Here's a review of his book on the French Revolution which is not entirely hostile (only accusing him of being "idealist"):http://www.worldsocialism.org/spgb/socialist-standard/1910s/1910/no-67-march-1910/kropotkin-french-revolutionIn this review of a book by French syndicalists "Prince Kropotkin" is compared favourably to them:http://www.worldsocialism.org/spgb/socialist-standard/1910s/1913/no-107-july-1913/how-we-are-be-saved-syndicalismThe thing about Kropotkin that Party members have liked is his anti-Social Darwinism book Mutual Aid which was favourably reviewed in the American party's journal in 1956 and on the WSPUS's list of books for sale:http://theworldsocialist.blogspot.co.uk/2008/04/paul-matticks-review-of-kropotkins.html

    #132083
    alanjjohnstone
    Keymaster

    As you say, ALB, I recall that "Mutual Aid" was listed each month in the Western Socialist and that was my first introduction to him and a copy of it became part of the library of nearly every SPGB member i knew. Other books of his were often added such as " Conquest of Bread" and "Fields Factories and Workshops".Bakunin wasn't much discussed or read. The other popular anarchist book was Freedom Press edition of "ABC of Anarchism" by Alexander Berkman, another anarchist work that merited a sympathetic review by the Party members i was acquainted with and available at an excellent price, too.Berkman's personal history seems to be a reflection of the evolution of anarchism…from being an assassin/attentat (or at least an attempt at one) to a disillusioned participant in the Russian Revolution.I did get a copy of Plekhanov out of the public library but i don't think i knew of anyone at the time who had it on their book shelf. Perhaps it was just too hefty a tome.Black and Red  produced a number of pamphlets which i considered the overlap of socialist and anarchist ideasI certainly felt at that period there was distinct libertarian Marxist tradition emerging and growing but which many party members stood aloof from, distancing themselves from, practicing the hostility clause rather than taking advantage of a receptive change of attitude amongst some on "the Left". Speculatively, just maybe we also missed the bus with the fall of "state-socialism" and the adoption of a more liberatory co-operative and eco- socialist minded Leftism that replaced what Bookchin called workerism.StuartW did have a point where i agreed with him in principle but not in the actual practice, that we could have done a lot more with Occupy when we had a potential audience in an open gathering, inviting exchanges and engagement and in Edinburgh at least, i noticed some well-known Trotskyist names dropping their Party labels for what i considered clandestine entryism into that movement, rather than their usual strategy of creating some front-group to hijack  activists into.

    #132084
    KAZ
    Participant

    I may be mistaken about seeing Kropotkinalia being listed in early Standards. Just a recollection. I can't check as I sent all my copies back to base. It was either them or my 2000ADs. 

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