Ecuador

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  • #245806
    Lizzie45
    Participant

    If you could do that, I’d be grateful. If it was too much chew for you, I would also understand.

    I’m happy to do that BD, but I’d much prefer you contact Phyllis in the first instance – I’m sure you must have her contact details.

    BTW, I doubt you’ll be disappointed with the contents of the pamphlet!

    #245807
    Lizzie45
    Participant

    The prosecution of Trump on the charge that he attempted to overturn the results of the 2020 election is a clear case where democratic principles are alive. It was after all a jury of twenty or so ordinary citizens (read: workers) that indicted him. What’s undemocratic about that?

    Well said!

    In the meantime, Trump and his allies have been indicted in Georgia over the attempt to reverse the 2020 election results

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/14/donald-trump-georgia-indictment-2020-election

    But’s it’s all a dastardly ploy of course!

    #245811
    DJP
    Participant

    To link all this law stuff to another thread, Kautsky wrote extensively on this subject too – I’ve yet to read it to see how it compares to the SPGB but English translations are in this book. Unfortunately, it’s not on Marxists.org and the retail price is €153. Pirate copies can be found online on place like Library Genesis I’m told, but we shouldn’t promote that here..

    https://brill.com/display/title/33937

    #245812

    1: Grand juries. We’ve stopped using them here, but prosecutors in the states are very adept at feeding the jury, and since all they have to do is agree there is a prima facie case, that doesn’t really mean anything.
    2: As some have pointed out, Hunter Biden is much like a lot of his peers – there’s all sorts of criminality everywhere, but for the most part they just get away with it – likewise for Trump, much of his criminality would never have come to light if he hadn’t become president. There is no contradiction between saying that lots of the scrutiny is politically motivated, and that they did it.
    3: It’s like the late Roman republic, they were all corrupt, that was how the system worked, and it was strategically remembering the crimes of people who fell from grace that led to the reputations of the likes of Cato.
    4: The important thing is that there is no discussion of principle, the Dems need Trump and his fash adjacent followers to be the bogey to marshal votes behind while promising zero structural change.

    #245813
    ALB
    Keymaster

    DJP, here’s another contribution to the debate by one of the Party’s legal eagles. Ronnie Warrington (then still a member) mentioning the concept of a classless non-legal social order:

    https://legalform.files.wordpress.com/2019/03/warrington-standing-pashukanis-on-his-head.pdf

    #245816
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Marx and Engels wrote about a society based on customs, based on free associated labor, it was also described by Marx on his ethnological notebooks. Lewis Morgan also indicated that the society of the Sioux was based on customs, and they did not need lawyers, judges, jails, magistrate, courts, polices, the worst punishment for a Sioux was to be expelled from their own society , the natives are suffering from depression, and other social diseases due to the fact that they were separated from their families, from their society, and law were imposed on them, it was a custom to be part of their families, it was a custom to love each others, it was a customs to respect natures and the animals, it was a custom to live in peace and harmony. We can not analyze the future society based on the legal system, it does not work, it must be analyzed from the anthological and historical point of view. A classless society does not need a legal system, the concept of mens rea or guilty mind will not exist in that society, because human being will know that behaviors are socially learned. Studying the Taino’s society we can see that the whole society and behaviors were based on customs

    #245817
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    To link all this law stuff to another thread, Kautsky wrote extensively on this subject too – I’ve yet to read it to see how it compares to the SPGB but English translations are in this book. Unfortunately, it’s not on Marxists.org and the retail price is €153. Pirate copies can be found online on place like Library Genesis I’m told, but we shouldn’t promote that here..

    https://brill.com/display/title/33937

    I have that book in softcover. I am going to send it to the home office or to Adam Buick

    PS To publish a book in the internet it is better to remove the back part like it is done by the bookbinders using a guillotine

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