Native American Land Claim

August 2020 Forums General discussion Native American Land Claim

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 24 total)
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  • #204972
    alanjjohnstone
    Participant

    <p class=”story-body__introduction”>Half of Oklahoma belongs to Native Americans including its second-biggest city, Tulsa.</p>
    Some 1.8 million people – of whom about 15% are Native American – live on the land, which spans three million acres.  The Five Tribes of Oklahoma – Cherokee, Chickasaw, Choctaw and Seminole and Muscogee Nation – welcomed the ruling.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-53358330

    #204977
    ALB
    Participant

    Here’s the bad news. They like all landowners will be expropriated when socialism comes and all that is on and in Earth becomes the common heritage of all humanity rather than the private property of some rich individual or some group.

    #204978
    alanjjohnstone
    Participant

    Reservations are technically not private owned land, are they?….but more like large concentration camps which they were designed to be despite the few that are now home to casinos.

    #204979
    ALB
    Participant

    Good point. I read more into the ruling than was there. It’s not making the land the property of the tribes just a re-arrangement concerning which department of the US state deals with criminal cases involving members of the tribes.

    #204981
    james19
    Participant

    ALB wrote

    Here’s the bad news. They like all landowners will be expropriated when socialism comes and all that is on and in Earth becomes the common heritage of all humanity rather than the private property of some rich individual or some group.

    lol

    #204993
    marcos
    Participant

    They do not own any land, and they can not sell it either, they are tenants in their own lands. The USA government has control over all the native reservations. They have violated all the treaties and accords signed with the natives, they have stolen everything from them, any reservation who had gold, silver or petroleum, or any natural resources able to produce profits the treaties were always violated. After five hundred years they continue suffering discrimination, oppression, killings and persecutions. Thousands of women disappear every year ( a good case for the feminists of the SPGB ) and many have been killed, they continue living in extreme poverty, unemployment, housing crisis, drugs addictions, and family separation. That is another holocaust without a Nuremberg trial.

    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by marcos.
    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by marcos.
    #205106
    alanjjohnstone
    Participant

    Congress would violate every one of the 375 treaties it made with Indian tribes as well as numerous statutory acts, according the United States Commission on Civil Rights.

    https://consortiumnews.com/2020/07/17/oklahoma-is-always-has-been-native-land/

    An article that is well worth taking the time to read

     

    #205115
    marcos
    Participant

    This is one of the best ( or probably the best ) book and historian to understand that particular situation and what happened to the natives of the North of the Americas, and also his book titled: Colonialism is a good read and several other books that he wrote about the natives ( no Indians )It is ironic and pathetic that his books have not been republished

    #205116
    marcos
    Participant

    https://www.amazon.com/Invasion-America-Colonialism-Published-University/dp/0807871443. The invasion of America, Colonialism is also a good book. The SLP made a review several years ago and it was published on The Peoples newspaper. There is also a new one written by a Native American who has a doctorate degree in History. During the struggles against the oil pipelines, some USA veterans took a knee and asked for forgiveness to the natives and thousands of peoples said that it was shameful to do that, it is curious how the ruling class influences in the minds of millions of human beings. What the natives have done against mankind to be hated?

    #205396
    alanjjohnstone
    Participant

    After two-hundred and fifty years the 215-member Esselen tribe of northern California is landless no more.

    250 years ago, Spanish soldiers built a military outpost in Monterey and Franciscan padres founded missions – places where tribal members were brought to be baptized and converted to Catholicism. By the early 1800s, nearly all of the remaining tribe had been decimated by disease and death. Esselen tribal members were stripped of their land, language and culture.

    They have now finalized the purchase of a 1,200-acre ranch near Big Sur, along California’s north central coast.

    The deal will conserve old-growth redwoods and endangered wildlife such as the California condor and red-legged frog, as well as protect the Little Sur River, an important spawning stream for the imperiled steelhead trout.
    “We’re the original stewards of the land. Now we’re returned,” Tom Little Bear Nason, chairman of the Esselen tribe of Monterey county, told the Santa Cruz Sentinel. “We are going to conserve it and pass it on to our children and grandchildren and beyond.”

    “We are back after a 250-year absence – because in 1770 our people were taken to the missions,” Nason told Monterey County Weekly. “Now we are back home. We plan on keeping this land forever.”

    They will share it with other groups also native to the area, including the Ohlone, the Amah Mutsun and the Rumsen people – all of whom were devastated by the arrival of white settlers.

    “Getting this land back gives privacy to do our ceremonies,” Nason said. “It gives us space and the ability to continue our culture without further interruption. This is forever, and in perpetuity, that we can hold on to our culture and our values.”

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jul/28/northern-california-esselen-tribe-regains-land-250-years

    #205398
    marcos
    Participant

    If they find petroleum, gas or gold in that area, they will violate the contract, the USA government has never honoured any agreement made with the Natives, they do not pay respect to anything. The Spanish had slaves in those so-called missions and one of those slaves holders was Fray Junipero Serra declared as a saint by the Vatican and his statue was taken down by the protesters. According to the Doctrine of discovery issued by the Vatican, all the  Europeans powers have the rights to take all the lands from the earth

     

    #205399
    marcos
    Participant

    https://www.voanews.com/usa/race-america/junipero-serra-statues-fall-protesters-question-california-missions.  Statue of Junipero Sierra was taken down. Thousands of natives were killed in those missions

    #205402
    ALB
    Participant

    There is clearly a lot of anger about but it is so misdirected. What do those who pulled the statue down want? It can’t be to return to the situation before the Spanish conquest as that is impossible. And if it’s monetary compensation they want that would only help them survive a little better under capitalism. Socialism is literally the only way out but I suppose they will say they want “something now”. That may make some sense if they also saw and worked for socialism as the solution, but not instead of it.

    #205408
    marcos
    Participant

    Pulling down statues, obtaining new regulations, and obtaining new land, and recovering their old ancestral territories will not resolve the problems. Capitalism will continue as it has been operating for more than 250 years, and any legislation can remove those reforms. In regard to the natives, they will continue living in the same situation of poverty and discrimination. As ALB has said, socialism is the only solution

    #205410
    alanjjohnstone
    Participant

    It is all a matter of relating socialism to contemporary conditions to make it resonate more to make a receptive audience, isn’t it?

    We cannot return society to an imaginary golden age but we can take lessons from the past to explain the pain of the present and suggest a better future.

    For instance, regards the Native American situation, we can show how the traditions and cultures of the Iroquois Confederation influenced Marx and Engels vision for socialism through the writings of Lewis Henry Morgan.

    I don’t think enough has been done, probably because we don’t possess the expertise.

    We could, however, start by constructing a reading list which would help.

    But we must caution against the concept of the ‘noble savage’, romanticising modern images of history.

    As for pulling down statues, people have always targeted symbols of their oppression as a positive act.

    As an aside, don’t know where i heard or read it but even the SLP retained a legacy of nationalism. At some meeting or other, the Stars and Stripes was placed on the floor at the entrance door, which meant trampling upon Old Glory. The SLP members declined to enter the hall.

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